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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've got a 1962 Remington 700 BDL, chambered in 7mm Magnum.

The rifle is in excellent shape except for the fact that the varnish on the butt stock and the white band, between the black end cap and the rest of the forend, have deteriorated. My best estimate is that about 10% of the varnish on the buttstock has flaked off. The white band on the forend is chipping out on one side. Structurally, the stock is sound. No chips, cracks, scratches, or gouges. Even the checkering is still excellent. The barreled action is in great shape.

Since the finish is deteriorated, the rifle isn't really of interest to a collector. So, I intend to refinish the stock and have a couple of questions for you all.

First, can anyone tell me what that white band between the forend and black forend cap is made of? I need to replace it and have no idea what I should be using.

Second, and this is simply an opinion question... I can either revarnish the stock and bring it back to as close to original as possible, or I can give it a hand rubbed, boiled linseed oil finish. The linseed oil finish is superior in many ways; but the varnish is closer to original. Since I do not intend to keep the rifle, I'm curious what you all think will be the better way to go.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
 

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With a refinished stock I would use oil rather than varnish. Easier for you or the next owner to repair. Not sure what the white spacer was originally made of, but I would use a piece of nylon.

Bob
 

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If it were mine, and I was not concerned about keeping it original I would go with oil, and in this case BLO.
 
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If it were mine, and I was not concerned about keeping it original I would go with oil, and in this case BLO.
The first years of production, Remington used a Duco Lacquer finish over stained walnut, hence the eventual cracking and peeling of the finish. By mid 1964, the new durable RK-W high gloss finish was being implemented. I personally would go back to matching the original finish, since the rest of the rifle sounds in excellent & original configuration.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
The first years of production, Remington used a Duco Lacquer finish over stained walnut, hence the eventual cracking and peeling of the finish. By mid 1964, the new durable RK-W high gloss finish was being implemented. I personally would go back to matching the original finish, since the rest of the rifle sounds in excellent & original configuration.
Thank you very much @3dtestify ...knowing what the original finish was will make life immensely easier to choose the right stripper... and I greatly appreciate your input on refinishing as well.

Any thoughts on what would be a suitable replacement, in terms of a lacquer finish? I'm most familiar with Deft, when it comes to lacquers, but I don't think that this would be the right application for it (that is primarily for interior/furniture applications). I did a few searches for RK-W and came up with nothing.
 

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Thank you very much @3dtestify ...knowing what the original finish was will make life immensely easier to choose the right stripper... and I greatly appreciate your input on refinishing as well.

Any thoughts on what would be a suitable replacement, in terms of a lacquer finish? I'm most familiar with Deft, when it comes to lacquers, but I don't think that this would be the right application for it (that is primarily for interior/furniture applications). I did a few searches for RK-W and came up with nothing.
Regarding the original Remington 700 finishes, they were both DuPont products provided to Remington at that time. The Duco lacquer hasn’t been available for many years, and the durable RK-W finish was a catalyzed specialty finish originally developed for the Brunswick Corp. for use in bowling. They quit using the RK-W finish by the mid 1980’s.

The Deft product I have heard of by reputation and would be a good lacquer finish to use for your restoration. There may be other products available, maybe someone else may have a suggestion.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Regarding the original Remington 700 finishes, they were both DuPont products provided to Remington at that time. The Duco lacquer hasn’t been available for many years, and the durable RK-W finish was a catalyzed specialty finish originally developed for the Brunswick Corp. for use in bowling. They quit using the RK-W finish by the mid 1980’s.

The Deft product I have heard of by reputation and would be a good lacquer finish to use for your restoration. There may be other products available, maybe someone else may have a suggestion.
Cool, Thanks so much for all the information. You have been very helpful.

I'm working on an early 80's Savage Model 24 right now (a previous owner slopped on a thick urethane over the original finish)... so I've got some time to flesh out all the details on the Model 700

You've clearly got a lot of knowledge on the Remington finishes... any chance you know what material they used for the white "spacer", between the forend and black end cap, on the BDL models? It looks to be a polymer of some kind. I didn't think to look (when I had the stock off the rifle) to see if the stock, spacer, and end cap are three separate pieces that are laminated together... or if the spacer is partial thickness... just filling a slot/groove, in a once piece stock, to separate the two finishes. Looking in that cavity, it could go either way.

5632
 

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Cool, Thanks so much for all the information. You have been very helpful.

I'm working on an early 80's Savage Model 24 right now (a previous owner slopped on a thick urethane over the original finish)... so I've got some time to flesh out all the details on the Model 700

You've clearly got a lot of knowledge on the Remington finishes... any chance you know what material they used for the white "spacer", between the forend and black end cap, on the BDL models? It looks to be a polymer of some kind. I didn't think to look (when I had the stock off the rifle) to see if the stock, spacer, and end cap are three separate pieces that are laminated together... or if the spacer is partial thickness... just filling a slot/groove, in a once piece stock, to separate the two finishes. Looking in that cavity, it could go either way.
Yes, its three pieces. The stock, white spacer and black forend tip. The tip is black plastic and the spacer is nylon, I believe. The easiest way to remedy may be to fill in the divit, since the tip and spacer are glued to the walnut stock with a bonding agent, making it difficult to remove to replace the spacer
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Yes, its three pieces. The stock, white spacer and black forend tip. The tip is black plastic and the spacer is nylon, I believe. The easiest way to remedy may be to fill in the divit, since the tip and spacer are glued to the walnut stock with a bonding agent, making it difficult to remove to replace the spacer
I have to admit, I never would've expected that the tip was plastic. I figured it was wood painted with a black lacquer. Honestly, I think this will make it an easier repair. I do a lot of woodworking, so I've got a pretty well-outfitted woodshop and, if this is the case, I can just cut that spacer out on the bandsaw with a thin kerf blade and clean the remnants off the cap and stock with the belt sander (or worst case a sharp chisel). Then I can cut a new piece from some white nylon sheet and glue it all back together. I think the biggest trick will be clamping for the glue up... but, I can just make a jig for that.

For the bond between the nylon strip and the plastic cap, I assume Cyanoacrylate would be best. But, what about the nylon to wood bond? Same thing?
 

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I have to admit, I never would've expected that the tip was plastic. I figured it was wood painted with a black lacquer. Honestly, I think this will make it an easier repair. I do a lot of woodworking, so I've got a pretty well-outfitted woodshop and, if this is the case, I can just cut that spacer out on the bandsaw with a thin kerf blade and clean the remnants off the cap and stock with the belt sander (or worst case a sharp chisel). Then I can cut a new piece from some white nylon sheet and glue it all back together. I think the biggest trick will be clamping for the glue up... but, I can just make a jig for that.

For the bond between the nylon strip and the plastic cap, I assume Cyanoacrylate would be best. But, what about the nylon to wood bond? Same thing?
The key will be removing the white spacer without removing the black forend tip. The tip has two plastic studs that embed & glue into the walnut stock . If you use a saw blade & cut the spacer completely though, the black forend tip will fall off. Removing the outer edge of the spacer & filling back in with trimmed material, then sanding to finish level may be the way to do this?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The key will be removing the white spacer without removing the black forend tip. The tip has two plastic studs that embed & glue into the walnut stock . If you use a saw blade & cut the spacer completely though, the black forend tip will fall off. Removing the outer edge of the spacer & filling back in with trimmed material, then sanding to finish level may be the way to do this?
Okay, good, I'm glad they did it that way. I was thinking that gluing directly to the end grain of the wood seemed like a weak joint and came to the conclusion that installing through-pins to join all three components would be the best way to get a strong joint. So, that is exactly what I wanted to do. The fact that this is consistent with the original design makes me pretty happy.

Your suggested method would definitely be a lot faster, easier in many ways (than what I am thinking), and would produce a good result. However, cleaning out that slot and getting a nice edge on both the stock and end cap sides will be tough... and cutting the spacer to get the right fit (if using sheet stock) could be very difficult (in terms of matching thickness, if that gap is anything other than a perfect 1/8"). I think that using a colored (liquid) epoxy would be a lot easier than nylon sheet stock... like what is used in some custom furniture-making (see photo).
5634

I'm fairly certain you can get this stuff in white. Put some painter's tape around the outside of the stock, to create a 'container', mix it and pack it in the gap from the top; put some more painter's tape in the barrel inlet to keep it in the upper part of the gap while it sets; then do a final sanding.

My plan was to cut the spacer out, removing the end cap entirely (as you stated). Then I can easily clean up the joint end of both the stock and cap, removing all of the old spacer and having a perfectly prepped face for bonding. Then drill, pin, and bond.

Using the pins will allow me to shape the spacer so that it makes a perfect transition between the plastic cap and the stock without having to bond all three pieces then sand them as a single unit. This will save a lot of headaches. Sanding them as a single unit to get a smooth transition means:
  • There would be some removal of material from both the stock and end cap, which I would like to avoid if possible.
  • I would then have to buff the spacer and end cap after final sanding, which could affect the finish on the leading edge of the stock (masking that isn't always effective with the buffing wheel... it can burn through the tape... even if it doesn't, the friction can cause the adhesive to break down and soak into the untreated wood).
  • I'd have to apply the finish to the stock after bonding... with a linseed oil finish, this isn't a big deal as there is no build up; but, with a lacquer finish there is a build up. So, the transition from wood to spacer/end cap will no longer be perfectly smooth.
If I pin them, I can finish the stock first, then cut and shape the spacer to make the perfect transition. After that, I can bond the spacer to the end cap, do a final 400/600 grit touch up (which will not remove any measurable amount of material), and do a final polish with the buffing wheel. This will get rid of the few little scratches that are in the end cap. Then I can bond that assembly to the stock and everything will look perfect.

Since there is already a set of pins in there, I can just drill them out and that will make placement of the new ones even easier. A simple jig that references off of the top edge of the stock and barrel inlet will make alignment easy.

I'm going to have to think about which method will be best overall... clean the gap and epoxy fill... or cut it apart, then re-pin and re-bond.

I definitely think that the lacquer finish will be a lot easier than the linseed oil... mainly because, the checkering in the stock is pressed, so it is almost impossible to get all of the old lacquer out without ruining it. If it was cut checkering, I could just re-cut it.. Since lacquer is solvent-based, even if there is a tiny bit left in the checkering, the solvent in the new lacquer should soften the old stuff and the two layers should bond well. If I was to do a linseed oil finish, I'd have to sand all the pressed checkering out and cut new checkering. At that point, I might as well just buy a new, unfinished stock.

If I do decide to cut it apart and resin/re-bond, does cyanoacrylate seem like the right choice for an adhesive?
 

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Okay, good, I'm glad they did it that way. I was thinking that gluing directly to the end grain of the wood seemed like a weak joint and came to the conclusion that installing through-pins to join all three components would be the best way to get a strong joint. So, that is exactly what I wanted to do. The fact that this is consistent with the original design makes me pretty happy.

Your suggested method would definitely be a lot faster, easier in many ways (than what I am thinking), and would produce a good result. However, cleaning out that slot and getting a nice edge on both the stock and end cap sides will be tough... and cutting the spacer to get the right fit (if using sheet stock) could be very difficult (in terms of matching thickness, if that gap is anything other than a perfect 1/8"). I think that using a colored (liquid) epoxy would be a lot easier than nylon sheet stock... like what is used in some custom furniture-making (see photo).
View attachment 5634
I'm fairly certain you can get this stuff in white. Put some painter's tape around the outside of the stock, to create a 'container', mix it and pack it in the gap from the top; put some more painter's tape in the barrel inlet to keep it in the upper part of the gap while it sets; then do a final sanding.

My plan was to cut the spacer out, removing the end cap entirely (as you stated). Then I can easily clean up the joint end of both the stock and cap, removing all of the old spacer and having a perfectly prepped face for bonding. Then drill, pin, and bond.

Using the pins will allow me to shape the spacer so that it makes a perfect transition between the plastic cap and the stock without having to bond all three pieces then sand them as a single unit. This will save a lot of headaches. Sanding them as a single unit to get a smooth transition means:
  • There would be some removal of material from both the stock and end cap, which I would like to avoid if possible.
  • I would then have to buff the spacer and end cap after final sanding, which could affect the finish on the leading edge of the stock (masking that isn't always effective with the buffing wheel... it can burn through the tape... even if it doesn't, the friction can cause the adhesive to break down and soak into the untreated wood).
  • I'd have to apply the finish to the stock after bonding... with a linseed oil finish, this isn't a big deal as there is no build up; but, with a lacquer finish there is a build up. So, the transition from wood to spacer/end cap will no longer be perfectly smooth.
If I pin them, I can finish the stock first, then cut and shape the spacer to make the perfect transition. After that, I can bond the spacer to the end cap, do a final 400/600 grit touch up (which will not remove any measurable amount of material), and do a final polish with the buffing wheel. This will get rid of the few little scratches that are in the end cap. Then I can bond that assembly to the stock and everything will look perfect.

Since there is already a set of pins in there, I can just drill them out and that will make placement of the new ones even easier. A simple jig that references off of the top edge of the stock and barrel inlet will make alignment easy.

I'm going to have to think about which method will be best overall... clean the gap and epoxy fill... or cut it apart, then re-pin and re-bond.

I definitely think that the lacquer finish will be a lot easier than the linseed oil... mainly because, the checkering in the stock is pressed, so it is almost impossible to get all of the old lacquer out without ruining it. If it was cut checkering, I could just re-cut it.. Since lacquer is solvent-based, even if there is a tiny bit left in the checkering, the solvent in the new lacquer should soften the old stuff and the two layers should bond well. If I was to do a linseed oil finish, I'd have to sand all the pressed checkering out and cut new checkering. At that point, I might as well just buy a new, unfinished stock.

If I do decide to cut it apart and resin/re-bond, does cyanoacrylate seem like the right choice for an adhesive?
A wood tip is normally bonded with wood glue. A plastic tip would normally be bonded with a firearms grade epoxy such as Brownell’s AcraGlas or Glassbed.
 

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Guys,
I moved this thread and made it a sticky. Great info. Nice tip on the lacquer and checkering. Please post a picture when finished!
 
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